Great info! If someone does regularly perform pull ups or pulldowns, would you still recommend this? Maybe this stretch is already built into these exercises - as long as the scapulae are being elevated/arms extended (full range of motion)? Thank you.
We've considered this in depth. The hanging traction must be performed as a separate operation. Do not mix the hanging traction (performed passively in most cases) in with an activity performed as exercise.
One part of this segregation is that exercises like those you mention need to be performed NO MORE than one set, once or twice a week (with several intervening days of rest) while the hanging traction may be indicated for once or several times daily. And for those who need the traction "as needed" like me, a means to perform it at home is an important consideration.
All of this is addressed in my books but not in Kirsch's book.
Another Point: With the shoulder hanging traction, avoid extremely wide grips.
Although Kirsch does not address grip width, I suggest a grip that allows the extended arms to be about parallel. However, many, like me, cannot tolerate this, although I test this occasionally for myself.
Much wider than the angles made outward [Never position inward from parallel.] from parallel by my pictured humeri and the parallelogram forces become excessive. Instead of pulling the arms upwards (superiorly), the forces are tending to bisect the body sagittally, thus pulling the shoulders apart more horizontally and less vertically.
This explains why, in crucifixion, most of the body must be supported by the legs.
You recommend a neutral grip (which I generally prefer for all my HIT exercises). If someone only has access to a regular straight pull up bar, is a standard pronated grip still acceptable (for someone with healthy shoulders who wants them to stay that way)?
In this case you describe, a pronated grip is required to obtain the correct humeral attitude for the hanging traction; however, this grip places the hands and wrists in their weakest position.
Although Kirsch fails to explain this, he does aptly suggest the use of wrist hooks and provides sources for them. They are absolutely required for the pronated grip that is required for the hanging traction on a regular, singular, straight bar. [Of course, for performing the pull-up or pulldown exercises, a pronated grip is contraindicated.]
Wrist hooks are even advisable for many subjects who are afforded a way to grip handles that allow a neutral grip.
Note that gloves often make gripping more comfortable but also require a stronger grip because the gloves' material make the handles effectively larger and therefore more of a gripping challenge.
Warning: A Source of Possible Confusion (and I don't believe explained in either my book or by Kirsch): When we mention "neutral grip" we mean a grip whereby the hands are midway between fully supinated and fully pronated. This attitude is NOT the "neutral" or "zero" of standard anatomical position.
Standard anatomical position depends on the image of a subject standing in such a way that all major joints of the body are in their natural or "neutral" or muscularly relaxed positions, EXCEPT the wrists and forearms. This standard position has the hands fully supinated (thumbs pointing laterally) requiring deliberate contraction of the supinating musculature. A truly neutral position is with the thumbs pointing anteriorly instead of {directly} laterally.
I’ve had Kirsch’s book since it came out on 2013, and use hanging traction to manage my grade 3 shoulder separation. Really glad Ken is recommending this!
I bought Ken's shoulder book, then Kirsch's book, and started to apply this method to select clients with very problematic shoulders at the end of their strength sessions. Results have been positive for all; no one is worse off for having tried it. In my experience there's definitely something very positive about this technique -- at least for folks with existing problems.
Admittedly, I'm hesitant to apply hanging to myself because I don't have shoulder pain or problems of any kind, and I'd be pissed if I earned one by rocking a boat that needn't be rocked. In a sense I have nothing to gain and everything to lose. However, I will revisit this over time. Perhaps hanging has a prophylactic benefit I'm underestimating.
I believe that it is prophylactic as well as curative. Kirsch alludes to this as well.
Consistent with your statement, you should not brush your teeth until after you have tooth decay. I have seen instances of people causing serious harm to themselves by brushing their teeth in such a way that they caused their gums to bleed and grooves on tooth enamel as if sawing though the teeth. But performed correctly, daily brushing is prophylactic and safe.
Wolff's Law--as Kirsch explains--works against us as we age to close off the space between the humeral head and the coraco-acromial arch, leading to shoulder issues. Routine hanging traction reverses or stalls this closure.
Point taken, but the limitation of the tooth brushing analogy is that countless people have brushed prophylactically, so I have a feel for what can go wrong. I have no such feel for the unintended consequences of hanging.
Great info! If someone does regularly perform pull ups or pulldowns, would you still recommend this? Maybe this stretch is already built into these exercises - as long as the scapulae are being elevated/arms extended (full range of motion)? Thank you.
We've considered this in depth. The hanging traction must be performed as a separate operation. Do not mix the hanging traction (performed passively in most cases) in with an activity performed as exercise.
One part of this segregation is that exercises like those you mention need to be performed NO MORE than one set, once or twice a week (with several intervening days of rest) while the hanging traction may be indicated for once or several times daily. And for those who need the traction "as needed" like me, a means to perform it at home is an important consideration.
All of this is addressed in my books but not in Kirsch's book.
Thanks for your pertinent question.
Thank you for taking the time for such a detailed answer. I very much appreciate your willingness to share information and help people.
Another Point: With the shoulder hanging traction, avoid extremely wide grips.
Although Kirsch does not address grip width, I suggest a grip that allows the extended arms to be about parallel. However, many, like me, cannot tolerate this, although I test this occasionally for myself.
Much wider than the angles made outward [Never position inward from parallel.] from parallel by my pictured humeri and the parallelogram forces become excessive. Instead of pulling the arms upwards (superiorly), the forces are tending to bisect the body sagittally, thus pulling the shoulders apart more horizontally and less vertically.
This explains why, in crucifixion, most of the body must be supported by the legs.
You recommend a neutral grip (which I generally prefer for all my HIT exercises). If someone only has access to a regular straight pull up bar, is a standard pronated grip still acceptable (for someone with healthy shoulders who wants them to stay that way)?
In this case you describe, a pronated grip is required to obtain the correct humeral attitude for the hanging traction; however, this grip places the hands and wrists in their weakest position.
Although Kirsch fails to explain this, he does aptly suggest the use of wrist hooks and provides sources for them. They are absolutely required for the pronated grip that is required for the hanging traction on a regular, singular, straight bar. [Of course, for performing the pull-up or pulldown exercises, a pronated grip is contraindicated.]
Wrist hooks are even advisable for many subjects who are afforded a way to grip handles that allow a neutral grip.
Note that gloves often make gripping more comfortable but also require a stronger grip because the gloves' material make the handles effectively larger and therefore more of a gripping challenge.
Warning: A Source of Possible Confusion (and I don't believe explained in either my book or by Kirsch): When we mention "neutral grip" we mean a grip whereby the hands are midway between fully supinated and fully pronated. This attitude is NOT the "neutral" or "zero" of standard anatomical position.
Standard anatomical position depends on the image of a subject standing in such a way that all major joints of the body are in their natural or "neutral" or muscularly relaxed positions, EXCEPT the wrists and forearms. This standard position has the hands fully supinated (thumbs pointing laterally) requiring deliberate contraction of the supinating musculature. A truly neutral position is with the thumbs pointing anteriorly instead of {directly} laterally.
On Ken's recommendation, we keep Kirsch's book in our studio. However, this article provides a great quick fix. Many thanks, Ken
I’ve had Kirsch’s book since it came out on 2013, and use hanging traction to manage my grade 3 shoulder separation. Really glad Ken is recommending this!
thanks Ken
I bought Ken's shoulder book, then Kirsch's book, and started to apply this method to select clients with very problematic shoulders at the end of their strength sessions. Results have been positive for all; no one is worse off for having tried it. In my experience there's definitely something very positive about this technique -- at least for folks with existing problems.
Admittedly, I'm hesitant to apply hanging to myself because I don't have shoulder pain or problems of any kind, and I'd be pissed if I earned one by rocking a boat that needn't be rocked. In a sense I have nothing to gain and everything to lose. However, I will revisit this over time. Perhaps hanging has a prophylactic benefit I'm underestimating.
I believe that it is prophylactic as well as curative. Kirsch alludes to this as well.
Consistent with your statement, you should not brush your teeth until after you have tooth decay. I have seen instances of people causing serious harm to themselves by brushing their teeth in such a way that they caused their gums to bleed and grooves on tooth enamel as if sawing though the teeth. But performed correctly, daily brushing is prophylactic and safe.
Wolff's Law--as Kirsch explains--works against us as we age to close off the space between the humeral head and the coraco-acromial arch, leading to shoulder issues. Routine hanging traction reverses or stalls this closure.
Point taken, but the limitation of the tooth brushing analogy is that countless people have brushed prophylactically, so I have a feel for what can go wrong. I have no such feel for the unintended consequences of hanging.